tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post8467414918664792159..comments2024-03-28T00:41:13.514-07:00Comments on B/X BLACKRAZOR: Playing With TravellerJBhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comBlogger26125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-59246074372183819612015-02-25T04:38:55.340-08:002015-02-25T04:38:55.340-08:00@ Warren:
I've got Terminal Space for my D&am...@ Warren:<br /><br />I've got Terminal Space for my D&D in the outer dark antics.<br />: )JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-21608877027350983572015-02-23T00:31:55.397-08:002015-02-23T00:31:55.397-08:00I was going to recommend Megatraveller as it does ...I was going to recommend Megatraveller as it does a lot to address your disappointments however that might be missing your central theme. You got CT because you wanted CT right? The suggestion of Starter Traveller (or the Traveller Book) is a good one as it (they) are like a amended version of CT rather than a new version. I can't recall if Book 1 in later printing has the 2 skills per term for scouts and Gun Combat 0 for PC's but they are examples of some of the ideas added to CT before MT showing GDW was aware players weren't enamored with character generation. Also Supplement 4 is one of the best expansions including adding bows and crossbows so you can play D&D in space!Warrenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11354178086764394097noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-60344269304889731202015-02-21T11:09:43.248-08:002015-02-21T11:09:43.248-08:00Huh, when my friends and I "played" Trav...Huh, when my friends and I "played" Traveller, we mostly did character generation because we thought it was so entertaining. I <i>still</i> go back to my CT books and play the mini-game of char-gen because I get a kick out of it...FrDavehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00459281821319914530noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-63347821520077878962015-02-20T22:35:21.913-08:002015-02-20T22:35:21.913-08:00"Another idea would be to have a choice of sk...<i>"Another idea would be to have a choice of skills available based on random roll"</i><br /><br />Yeah, that's the solution MegaTraveller used, with the large number of "cascade skills". That included things like "Physical", which was a +1 to Str, Dex, or End.faoladhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03691952430041394614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-83498048535639878422015-02-20T20:53:53.780-08:002015-02-20T20:53:53.780-08:00@ Faol:
I'm glad it's helpful!
I'm c...@ Faol:<br /><br />I'm glad it's helpful!<br /><br />I'm certainly not opposed to randomness in character creation...not even with regard to skills. There's just some slight tweaks to the overall implementation I'd prefer. Mongoose does a good thing (IMO) with their additional "group skills."<br /><br />Another idea would be to have a choice of skills available based on random roll...for example, a roll of a "2" indicates a "combat skill" and allows the player a choice from a number of weapon options (blade, brawl, gun, gunnery, etc.). A "3" might indicate a selection from the "starship" table (pilot, nav, engineer, computer).<br /><br />Different careers paths might have weighted tables ("starship" on a 3-4 for scouts, for example). All careers might eceive a choice of "attribute upgrade" on a roll of "1."<br /><br />In other words, keep it random but narrow down the wild divergence. Just an idea.<br />; )JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-73936858278972954642015-02-20T18:56:49.867-08:002015-02-20T18:56:49.867-08:00Well, there's quite a bit of discussion here. ...Well, there's quite a bit of discussion here. Yeah, I can see why, when you approach it like later games (where characters can only do the things on their sheet), CT might look a little spare. The big thing you seem to have a problem with is the highly random nature of character creation. That was something that a lot of people had a problem with, which is why it was fixed in MegaTraveller to a great extent by adding a lot more "cascade skills", where the person rolling up the character had a lot more choice in terms of which specific skills they'd have. Still, since skills in CT are not usually requirements, but are instead bonuses, it's not as important.<br /><br />I should add that this discussion and the things that it is making me think about are really helpful to me right now, since I am working on a pulp SF game, heavily inspired by Northwest Smith, Lensman, and Flash Gordon, with a touch of Krull, Barsoom, Star Wars, and Dune.faoladhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03691952430041394614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-53785040663133476922015-02-20T18:47:11.554-08:002015-02-20T18:47:11.554-08:00Also, it is possible to travel by purchasing passa...Also, it is possible to travel by purchasing passage on someone else's ship. The group that doesn't have a ship of its own can be quite an interesting one.faoladhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03691952430041394614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-68353350642445805302015-02-20T18:45:27.113-08:002015-02-20T18:45:27.113-08:00Wait, you can't have a Scout with no Pilot ski...Wait, you can't have a Scout with no Pilot skill. They get a level for free on enlistment.faoladhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03691952430041394614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-55673462555014345862015-02-20T18:38:48.913-08:002015-02-20T18:38:48.913-08:00Yeah.
For what it is worth, though, the Supplemen...Yeah.<br /><br />For what it is worth, though, the Supplement 4 careers are very much in-line with the Book 1 careers.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16733274876782876659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-90435640213713121882015-02-20T18:00:38.529-08:002015-02-20T18:00:38.529-08:00@ Library Bob:
Yes, of course you're right (a...@ Library Bob:<br /><br />Yes, of course you're right (about the Scout)...which only makes sense given the concept of that career. When I wrote that, I wasn't looking at the auto skills.<br /><br />But the other guys' were made using the Merc rules (which gives possible skills more-or-less on a yearly basis, rather than a "per term"), and some of these were stat bonuses rather than skills. As it was, they all ended up with the majority of their stats at or below average (7). <br /><br />This isn't about an edition war thing. I've owned Mongoose for awhile, but have played just as much CT in the past (or more), and perhaps I was luckier with my character rolling back in the day (or perhaps my GM was more forgiving). They played pretty much the same from what I can tell. However, this is the first time I've owned the CT rules and really "taken them out for a test drive." I was a little disappointed by the result...that's all.JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-73171280784405944762015-02-20T17:49:17.460-08:002015-02-20T17:49:17.460-08:00Another reason may be that folks who've been p...Another reason may be that folks who've been playing CT for years have already added their own adjustments "to taste." I note that several of the characters in your log have careers other than those in the basic book (noble, doctor, etc.).<br />: )JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-56407869595299677832015-02-20T16:54:53.923-08:002015-02-20T16:54:53.923-08:00There's a table in the character generation se...There's a table in the character generation section called Automatic Skills. All members of the Scouts get Pilot-1 in their first term. Only the Other career doesn't have an Automatic skill award. Some of the characters you described don't sound like they have all the skills they should - the guy with Gambling, Gun Cbt and Zero-G should have at least two more skills, maybe more if he's gotten commissioned and promoted. With commission and promotion even a 1-term character will have 4 skill levels, plus an Automatic skill or two. <br />Creating characters (or planets) in CT is so simple and quick that if the first few you roll up don't suit or make sense, bank them as NPCs and roll on until you get one you like. But in the end, if MgT works for you, go with it. I don't want an edition war - play to have fun. Robert Weaverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07917387796213598551noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-60042973838239898382015-02-20T12:35:09.409-08:002015-02-20T12:35:09.409-08:00Here’s the party my group rolled up.
http://web.f...Here’s the party my group rolled up.<br /><br />http://web.fisher.cx/robert/rpg/traveller/log.html<br /><br />(Those zero level skills are “hobbies”. I let everyone pick one.)<br /><br />I think they managed to cover everything needed to operate the ship. And they still hired a pilot anyway. (Which ended up making things interesting.)<br /><br />Of course, starting with a ship is far from guaranteed and acquiring one is not easy. Travelling as often happens on other people’s ships in my experience.<br /><br />Figuring out how to get things done with the skills you have or how to pay/convince an NPC to loan you skills you don’t have has always been part of the game. (And only in the times when skills are really needed for what you want to do.)<br /><br />Of course, no one can argue that you were disappointed. I think we’re all just trying why these things aren’t disappointing for us.<br /><br />(Although the real answer may be that many of us started playing cT before we had many preconceptions for it to fail to meet. 😄)Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16733274876782876659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-38100233121543077232015-02-20T12:14:43.122-08:002015-02-20T12:14:43.122-08:00@ Library Bob (and others):
I understand that eve...@ Library Bob (and others):<br /><br />I understand that even 1 level in a skill equals professional level. The problem is the exceptional randomness of skill acquisition coupled with A) shortness of career, B) lack of critical skills (or the ability to select them). <br /><br />Here's a marine who ended up with Gun Combat 1, Recruiting 1, and Forward Observation 1. Here's a scout who, after three terms, still had no "pilot" skill. Here's another guy with Gambling 1, Gun Combat 1, and Zero-G after four terms.<br /><br />Pilot-1 is required to fly any interstellar craft. Only three careers have the ability to learn Pilot, and then only if they have an Education of 8+...at which point their chance is 1 in 6. Navigation (required for any 200t+ vessel) is the same except that merchants have a 1 in 6 chance of learning it (1 in 6 per term) even if their Education is under 8.<br /><br />It is highly possible, given the inherent difficulties of the system, that you could end up with a group of PCs who have no ability to actually "travel" without hiring a full crew of competent NPCs to perform engineering (right up there with navigation for difficulty), computer programming, etc. I'm speaking of the game using the Rules As Written, of course. There are plenty of ways to house rule the thing...but then why not simply play a later version (like Mongoose).<br /><br />I'm just saying I was a bit disappointed by what I found in Classic.JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-28428442836909795312015-02-20T11:41:26.542-08:002015-02-20T11:41:26.542-08:00@ Robert:
Ha! Thanks! As I wrote above, I hadn...@ Robert:<br /><br />Ha! Thanks! As I wrote above, I hadn't yet bothered to read Book 2 ("Starships") thinking it only had info pertaining to starships or something. Silly me!<br />; )<br /><br />Having now read the section, it appears to actually have MORE self-improvement rules than the Mongoose version (though I may well be misremembering). A little slow, a little clunky, but it IS there...I especially like the roll to see if folks can remain "dedicated" to a program (something most RPGs fail to take into account...and quite realistic).JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-61772597434145199812015-02-20T11:32:17.866-08:002015-02-20T11:32:17.866-08:00You say your sample characters were kicked out (Fa...You say your sample characters were kicked out (Failed reenlistment) before they "developed into anything resembling competence". Fair enough, a lot of characters end up with 1, 2 or 3 terms. It depends on your threshold for 'competence'. By the rules, a character of any age with Pilot-1 skill can get a job as a starship pilot, with a salary of 6,000 a month. That's at skill-1. The CT rules count the first skill as professional competence. <br />Have a look at this post from the Space Cockroach: http://spacecockroach.blogspot.com/2014/07/regarding-skills-in-classic-traveller.html <br />and then my follow-up post http://ancientfarfuture.blogspot.com/2014/08/casual-encounter-fenton-tukachevski.html Perhaps this will help with the understanding of 'competence' in CT. If the Mongoose version is more your thing, great; but MgT and CT are different. As Faoladh pointed out, CT is different from more modern games. But it is still very playable. Robert Weaverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07917387796213598551noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-6462301163009690912015-02-20T11:17:11.840-08:002015-02-20T11:17:11.840-08:00I failed to mention that Supplement 4: Citizens of...I failed to mention that <i>Supplement 4: Citizens of the Imperium</i> has some additional “basic” careers. I like to use them.<br /><br />I don’t use any of the “advanced” careers from books 4–7. They get more skills and arguably some of the skills are not as broad. So I find they don’t mix well with “basic” careers. You can boost the number of skills “basic” careers get to compensate, but I’d be more likely to look at adapting some stuff from T5 if I weren’t happy with the “basic” careers.<br /><br />And, yeah, I let characters attempt to enlist in another career when they fail an enlistment or reënlistment roll. Characters who haven’t completed any terms yet can always choose the draft, but they aren’t forced into it until they’ve failed to enlist in every career.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16733274876782876659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-68920940507673467872015-02-20T11:03:40.401-08:002015-02-20T11:03:40.401-08:00Book 2, pp. 42-43. I believe the heading is “Exper...Book 2, pp. 42-43. I believe the heading is “Experience” (though it doesn’t really seem to fit).<br /><br />I have a summary here:<br />http://web.fisher.cx/robert/rpg/traveller/experience.html<br /><br />Skill level zero eliminates the penalty for being unskilled. The way I play it, even zero is a (half) step above competent for most skills. I’m only going to call for a roll under extenuating conditions or for something that really requires a specialist. And I’ll set target numbers lower than I would in a game that gives characters more skills and higher skill levels.<br /><br />I don’t know how “by the book” or not that may be. It is just how I do it.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16733274876782876659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-30721955597303758312015-02-20T10:35:38.295-08:002015-02-20T10:35:38.295-08:00for that odd world you created, you might have to ...for that odd world you created, you might have to get creative with the die resultd. For example, maybe the low population high tech world is the result of discovered ancient alien civilization. The atmosphere is tainted because the aliens destroyed themselves long ago, leaving their tech to be discovered by the new inhabitants Darnizhaanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12067874224412746414noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-86627160126831416972015-02-20T09:54:03.253-08:002015-02-20T09:54:03.253-08:00@ Faol (and Robert):
Which book of the CT trilogy...@ Faol (and Robert):<br /><br />Which book of the CT trilogy discusses gaining additional skills AFTER character creation. I probably just missed it.<br /><br />I realize that level 0 is still "competent," but other than weapon skills, I don't think characters are explicitly level 0 in everything else. Perhaps this was clarified in a later CT supplement?JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-67483544845730903852015-02-20T09:26:03.651-08:002015-02-20T09:26:03.651-08:00i always catch meyself playing with different meth...i always catch meyself playing with different methods of world generation, the baseline just doesn't go wide or detailed enough for me.<br /><br />when we payed years back we didn't kill characters that died in creaation they were just done with charcter generation and got no mustering out benefits. Characters that mustered out or were even kicked out could just try another branch to develop further (the galaxy is a big place ).JDsivrajhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10674833512849495283noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-72418671071656856522015-02-20T09:24:13.434-08:002015-02-20T09:24:13.434-08:00i always catch meyself playing with different meth...i always catch meyself playing with different methods of world generation, the baseline just doesn't go wide or detailed enough for me.<br /><br />when we payed years back we didn't kill characters that died in creaation they were just done with charcter generation and got no mustering out benefits. Characters that mustered out or were even kicked out could just try another branch to develop further (the galaxy is a big place ).JDsivrajhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10674833512849495283noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-33469520603695935432015-02-20T08:18:54.055-08:002015-02-20T08:18:54.055-08:00for that odd world you created, you might have to ...for that odd world you created, you might have to get creative with the die resultd. For example, maybe the low population high tech world is the result of discovered ancient alien civilization. The atmosphere is tainted because the aliens destroyed themselves long ago, leaving their tech to be discovered by the new inhabitants Darnizhaanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12067874224412746414noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-27920008007422203772015-02-20T07:18:50.588-08:002015-02-20T07:18:50.588-08:00“It just takes a long time. Game years.”
In pract...“It just takes a long time. Game years.”<br /><br />In practice, though, if you’re doing a lot of travelling, the weeks can click by pretty fast.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16733274876782876659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-76648581283661181032015-02-20T07:16:50.640-08:002015-02-20T07:16:50.640-08:00When I play cT, I treat a character with no skills...When I play cT, I treat a character with no skills as competent. Even an 1 in a skill indicates that the character is a specialist in that area. Which I have to do with a skill-based system anyway, because otherwise they drive me crazy.<br /><br />I recommend picking up <i>Starter Traveller</i> too. It does not have everything that is in Books 1–3, but it has some examples that clarify some things.<br /><br />Actually, I recommend getting the classic <i>Traveller</i> CD direct from Far Future, because it is just too good of a deal.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16733274876782876659noreply@blogger.com