tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post671271138696068542..comments2024-03-28T22:28:01.028-07:00Comments on B/X BLACKRAZOR: Why I Love Energy DrainJBhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-23348692113246941062014-09-16T20:28:00.542-07:002014-09-16T20:28:00.542-07:00@ Sudo:
I have since (somewhat) softened my stanc...@ Sudo:<br /><br />I have since (somewhat) softened my stance on level drain, though for slightly different reasons. None of my undead in 5AK (for example) have the ability to drain levels. I think there are better, cooler ways to model a "draining of life-force."<br />: )JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-10270394702613319362014-09-16T17:36:35.536-07:002014-09-16T17:36:35.536-07:00As a DM for a year long running campaign I once de...As a DM for a year long running campaign I once decided to try and introduce level draining to the party of 4 level 7-9 characters. A few wights shouldn't do much right? Wrong.<br /><br />A entire year long campaign was ruined because of some bad rolls that ended with the main fighters of the party with 5 and 7 drained levels each and the one with the least drained levels was the thief who ended up at level 6. Now this was back in AD&D in a low magic campaign (high level clerics with restoration on the planet could be counted in one hand) and now months of XP has been stripped and the party ended up dying after trying to escape the dungeon and running into a pre planned monster that would have been easy if they haven't gotten drained of most of their levels. The players were so furious that one offered to be DM and I was voted to step down so we could start a new campaign. Never seen another wight or other level draining monster again.Sudokorihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04916730215131607856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-16874914939505141162010-11-09T22:10:54.645-08:002010-11-09T22:10:54.645-08:00@ Steel: that's not bad...I use similar rules ...@ Steel: that's not bad...I use similar rules for aging in my B/X Companion. However, in some ways its even more debilitating than actual energy drain...after all, a character reduced in level can always earn more experience points. You're talking about "gifting" a character with a permanent, cumulative curse!<br /><br />Actually, the more I think about it, the more I like it.<br />; )JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08532311924539491087noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-38414713748658356702010-11-09T21:04:21.784-08:002010-11-09T21:04:21.784-08:00I have different rules than everyone else for Ener...I have different rules than everyone else for Energy Drain, as recounted on my blog. I just simply assess a -1 penalty on every roll, that can't be cured except by a high-level spell none are likely to possess. And Scott's idea is great about the blighted, corrupted areas.Eric R. Wirsinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04632409261940844934noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-4513569665665635402010-11-03T09:09:17.327-07:002010-11-03T09:09:17.327-07:00I have to admit that even though the characters we...I have to admit that even though the characters we were using sprang forth fully formed at level 7, it was still seriously unnerving to face having one of those levels disappear on a roll of the dice. It definitely upped the "fear factor" of the encounter by an order of magnitude. Getting scared and surviving is fun! Getting scared and then getting your level drained completely sucks, though.<br /><br />I like the idea of their sheer unnaturalness giving you a bit of warning from Scott's post above... I'd consider taking it a step further. Something along the lines of "You can't be surprised by a nasty that can level drain because the sheer wrongness emanating from them makes everyone uneasy from a distance."<br /><br />Either way, I have a more healthy respect for the undead after that encounter... or should that read "unhealthy?"javamattehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10774485977555144887noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-78433297749740522282010-11-02T17:17:18.500-07:002010-11-02T17:17:18.500-07:00I've never been a big fan of Level Drain as a ...I've never been a big fan of Level Drain as a player or GM. But you know, the rationales you give in this post are quite good. I also DO appreciate the fact that such an attack is probably one of the most 'frightening' things to a player- even if it is partly a 'metagaming' fear, it still translates well into how a character would be feeling in-game.rologutweinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02186173153359166269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-28011086380279654412010-11-02T16:20:19.833-07:002010-11-02T16:20:19.833-07:00and I put this comment on the wrong post, didn'...and I put this comment on the wrong post, didn't I... whoopsPathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11381628150285913370noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-30558911811410999782010-11-02T16:18:57.154-07:002010-11-02T16:18:57.154-07:00Nerdy comment about orcs - in Lord of the Rings, t...Nerdy comment about orcs - in Lord of the Rings, they were bred into several subspecies, some of which were roughly hobbit-sized (remember Frodo & Sam blending in with the orc army on the march to the Black Gate). So dwarf-sized goblins in the Misty Mountains are probably what was going on.Pathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11381628150285913370noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-51762224378639603332010-11-02T15:44:29.572-07:002010-11-02T15:44:29.572-07:00I'm fine with energy drain. But then again, I...I'm fine with energy drain. But then again, I referee almost exclusively. As you noted, on an abstract level it's not particularly different than many other game mechanics. Getting hit with a poison attack and missing one's save is analogous on an abstract level to an energy drain succeeding on the attack matrix - the dispositive d20 is just getting rolled at a different time by a different person.<br /><br />I do, however, usually "flag" areas with energy-draining creatures as somehow corrupt and blighted. From a(n un)naturalistic standpoint, I find it unlikely that something like a Wight exists in a region without having some disruptive effect on the surroundings. It's one thing for the Undead to inspire fear - they should - but it's moot if the characters can't factor that fear into an intelligent decision-making process and either avoid the area or make appropriate preparations. Fear for fear's sake strikes me as the old "sadistic DM" boogeyman.<br /><br />Of course, sometimes the dice just buttfuck you.Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00155926145150934199noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-35618404741802765902010-11-02T15:08:04.089-07:002010-11-02T15:08:04.089-07:00If the level drain pulls you down some major rung ...If the level drain pulls you down some major rung of your class abilities, it's a much bigger deal than you mentioned, like our Dwarf going from 7 to 6 giving him an effective -3 penalty on attacks. Unless he has a +10 sword and always needs a 2 or better to hit, there's no making up for that. Or a spell caster losing an entire level of spells (like the cleric can't raise dead anymore, magic user can't fireball anymore).<br /><br />But the bummer about level drain isn't the game mechanics effect so much. XP is a measure of your progress in the game and level drain can erase that progress. It yanks away a lot of real time investment in your character, months if you're not a 13 year old that plays 16 hours every weekend. D&D isn't one of those 100% narrative games and I'm sure a good chunk of its players play at least in part to watch the numbers go up (xp, gold, level).<br /><br />I agree something as scary as level drain is great to have in the DM arsenal, but it should only be used judiciously. It's the DM's nuclear option. An effective use is something like "Oh no, discarded stakes and garlic on the ground. We must steel ourselves for the soul sucking vampire". Energy drain is super scary if you know you have to face it. If you prepare yourself and still fall victim, bummer but at least there's some drama.<br /><br />My beef with how it was used in the White Plume game is that it came from a randomly rolled wandering monster while we were sleeping. I wasn't even sure how we got surprised if we had a watch going. No forewarnings, no initiative rolls, just BAM your characters kinda suck now. Felt arbitrary not scary in that particular case.<br /><br />Also, and this is really minor point but a good one Josh mentioned to me, S2 was written for AD&D. The spell Restoration at least exists in AD&D (and doesn't in BX) which might have been a consideration for the author to put wights in the wandering monster table.<br /><br />Just to be clear, I think Jonathan is a super awesome DM. His enthusiasm and orthodoxy for BX is really intriguing. If I didn't like his game I wouldn't show up every week, and being able to bitch and moan on his blog is a fun bonus feature.Fumershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14156302616243889562noreply@blogger.com