tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post1916181555655659830..comments2024-03-28T21:12:06.818-07:00Comments on B/X BLACKRAZOR: Revising B/X Ability Scores (Oh, Boy!)JBhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-31611291159531559142014-09-01T01:27:56.295-07:002014-09-01T01:27:56.295-07:00Oh, believe me, I know! I consider that part of t...Oh, believe me, I know! I consider that part of the fun in D&D, and I've found OD&D to be especially rewarding in that regard (especially once you ditch any preconceptions based on later editions). Nobody can seem to agree on multi-classing, hit dice or how to incorporate <i>Chainmail</i>, and I love reading all these different viewpoints. It really gets one's creative juices flowing<br /><br />I bring up my interpretation not so much to argue what the "right way" is (though original intent is certainly an interesting subject in its own right), but to spread the exposure of different ideas. Even if you don't buy my interpretation, you might decide you like it better, or I might be influenced by your thoughts; even if we reach an impasse, we've still had an interesting discussion on the matter, which is something I didn't get much from the 3E community (especially after that horrible revision)Holly Oatshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01703437987958922954noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-12794890958913095162014-08-31T20:45:10.316-07:002014-08-31T20:45:10.316-07:00@ ProfOats:
There is plenty of stuff "open t...@ ProfOats:<br /><br />There is plenty of stuff "open to interpretation" in most editions of D&D...look at all the different rulings on cleric turning prior to 3E! You should always run with what's most appropriate (and, yeah, interesting) for your table and group. Regardless of what pseudo-intellectuals (like moi) might say is "the right way" to play.<br />; )JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-14941694387832399212014-08-31T18:57:55.442-07:002014-08-31T18:57:55.442-07:00Crap, my reply disappeared into the aether. Damn ...Crap, my reply disappeared into the aether. Damn you, Google!<br /><br />Basically, what I said was that the prime requisite itself isn't being increased, while the other scores are more debatable. I interpret that "Units so indicated" passage as meaning average or above scores in those abilities contribute towards the rate of progression, partly because of the language that one can <i>use</i> an ability in their prime requisite area, and partly because magic-users don't benefit from strength. It sounds like a convoluted way of saying each class has one score which, high or low, contributes totally towards the rate of experience, while the others only count if they're average or above, and even then it's to a lesser extent<br /><br />Admittedly, I could be wrong about all this (you make a good case when you say "you can't adjust the prime score unless it's going to change the rate at which you gain XP"), but I happen to like this method more than any other I've heard. Even if I became convinced that I was wrong, if I'm going to adjust experience points for stats, I'd still use this method. I find the characters it produces, and the choices it creates, more interestingHolly Oatshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01703437987958922954noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-34875449805787721472014-08-31T10:36:47.801-07:002014-08-31T10:36:47.801-07:00@ JD:
Absolutely. But in the new FHB I've on...@ JD: <br /><br />Absolutely. But in the new FHB I've only got (maybe) one creature that does AB damage, and only to Strength. And I'm trying to get away from the D20 under AB mechanic. Not because it's not useful but because:<br /><br />A) it (again) lends more value to ability scores than I feel they warrant,<br />B) in a good (IMO) game, they shouldn't be called for too often, mainly due to them<br />C) having a relatively high chance o failure (which isn't a terribly cool way to reward a player who came up with an interesting thing to do outside the standard rules).<br /><br />: )JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-23930609434588432822014-08-31T10:22:24.738-07:002014-08-31T10:22:24.738-07:00The breakpoint issue disapears with direct ability...The breakpoint issue disapears with direct ability checks against the score itself and ability damage (if you want to bother with that).JDJarvishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07691101939920824546noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-12540677948279783262014-08-31T08:41:22.440-07:002014-08-31T08:41:22.440-07:00@ ProfOats:
Hmm, yeah...we are interpreting that ...@ ProfOats:<br /><br />Hmm, yeah...we are interpreting that differently. I'd say the "for purpose of gaining XP only" means you can't adjust the prime score unless it's going to change the rate at which you gain XP. But the scores are still adjusted.<br /><br />Otherwise the later section (bottom of page 11) doesn't make sense:<br /><br />"Units so indicated above may be used to increase prime requisite total insofar as this does not bring the category below average, i.e. below a score of 9."JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-41687090563774205162014-08-30T10:18:10.729-07:002014-08-30T10:18:10.729-07:00We're interpreting OD&D differently here. ...We're interpreting OD&D differently here. The way I read it, you don't actually adjust your stats at all ("for purposes of gaining experience only"). For example, if you rolled up a fighting-man with STR 13, INT 11 and WIS 12, all those stats would stay the same, but he'd get a 10% bonus to experience rather than 5%Holly Oatshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01703437987958922954noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-89396649318275895892014-08-30T05:58:57.187-07:002014-08-30T05:58:57.187-07:00Regarding OD&D, I think I'd disagree. Sinc...Regarding OD&D, I think I'd disagree. Since the prime three ability scores lack any mechanical bonus besides XP adjustment, there's no reason not to lower your non-primes and raise your prime, making for a 'stereotypical' character. Remember, only STR, INT, and WIS can be lowered in OD&D (same as B/X) which doesn't interfere with any o the bonus-awarding abilities.<br /><br />(no worries on the long post, BTW)<br />: )JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-10327022680916746132014-08-29T20:54:31.593-07:002014-08-29T20:54:31.593-07:00Oh God, that looked so much smaller when I was typ...Oh God, that looked so much smaller when I was typing it! Sorry for the wall of textHolly Oatshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01703437987958922954noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-41424883787803022752014-08-29T20:53:29.622-07:002014-08-29T20:53:29.622-07:00Personally, I love having penalties in the game. ...Personally, I love having penalties in the game. I always enjoyed having one or two for every character, though no more than that and I didn't like scores to be lower than 6. Penalties would really suck if they overrode player skill, though ("your character's too stupid to think of that!")<br /><br />I've always felt 4d6 drop the lowest produces scores that are too high, but they should work for heroic characters, especially if players can arrange scores to taste (I preferred the organic method). 3e allowed rerolls if your character failed to get at least one score higher than 13 and a positive sum of all your modifiers, which helped to spread the stats out a little more. I'm considering something similar, but with lower minimums<br /><br />If you want every point to count without letting the modifiers get too high, I'd suggest having each stat adjust multiple traits, but the modifiers change at different points. Alternatively, two scores might share the same modifier, but one also acts as a prerequisite for some kind of special ability<br /><br />I suppose the doesn't really help you, but I just have to gush about OD&D for a sec. Rewarding you for stats other than your prime encouraged more diverse characters, as opposed to Basic's encouragement that all fighters be strong and dumb, all clerics wise but frail, etc. You could theoretically even have character whose highest score of the three primes <i>isn't</i> the prime requisite of the class he'd advance fastest in. Unfortunately, that's pretty unlikely. I thought about tweaking the numbers to make this more prominent, but the same thing can be achieved by dropping the experience bonus and just having those stats adjust things just like the others doHolly Oatshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01703437987958922954noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-72713676948381589682014-08-29T19:25:14.610-07:002014-08-29T19:25:14.610-07:00Sounds so very much like my B/X homage game. Stats...Sounds so very much like my B/X homage game. Stats 8-18 for PCs but 3-18 for general population. <br /><br />In my 0e homage game, there are no stat numbers, only the modifiers, and only -1 to +1. PCs start with 1 or 2 exceptional stats (random roll, but heavily weighted to only one) arranged to taste. They can take an inferior stat to boost a normal one to exceptional too. Scott Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12067161332003628237noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4143435314932633148.post-12532937036746659142014-08-29T18:14:36.238-07:002014-08-29T18:14:36.238-07:00i use stat more - use for skill rolls, i have int ...i use stat more - use for skill rolls, i have int bonus provide skills, bonus spells for all classes, i have a second chance points derived from wisdom (foresight/divine help) and cha derived followers - strength is now the dump stat - get a strong follower isteadKonsumterrahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18170560484656800416noreply@blogger.com